“Sex isn’t something you’re supposed to just know—it’s something you learn. And when you do, it changes everything.” – Susan Bratton
Betrayal can rupture more than trust—it can sever our connection to pleasure, to our bodies, and to our sense of self. But what if the path to healing included more joy, more intimacy, and the best sex of your life?
In this groundbreaking episode, Lora Cheadle sits down with Susan Bratton, bestselling author, sexual biohacker, and intimacy expert to millions, to explore what it really takes to heal after betrayal and reignite your desire—not just with a partner, but within yourself.
From Susan’s raw and personal story of infidelity, open marriage, and reclaiming her marriage and sexual sovereignty, to practical tools for somatic healing, bedroom communication, and extending your “sex span” as you age—this episode will change the way you think about sex, healing, and what’s truly possible.
Top Three Takeaways
- Healing Is a Mind-Body Journey
Healing from betrayal requires somatic integration, emotional processing, and relational repair. It’s not about “getting over it,” but about expanding through it.
- Sexual Vitality is the Fourth Health Factor
Great sex isn’t a bonus—it’s essential. Just like sleep, nutrition, and exercise, regular intimate pleasure enhances immunity, cardiovascular health, emotional resilience, and brain function. - Communication Is the Cornerstone of Intimacy
From the Soulmate Embrace to the Magic Pill Method, Susan shares actionable tools that couples can use to restore trust, reawaken desire, and co-regulate nervous systems after betrayal.
Mentioned Resources & Free Downloads from Susan Bratton:
- BetterLover.com – Sign up for Susan’s free newsletter packed with pleasuring techniques, communication skills, libido tips, and more.
- Magic Pill Method – A free 5-step guide to talk through sexual shutdowns and reignite intimacy.
- Soulmate Embrace – Learn how to reconnect emotionally and physically through this grounding, oxytocin-boosting practice.
- The20 Store – Shop DESIRE and FLOW, Susan’s libido-enhancing and nitric oxide-boosting supplements for men and women.
- Better Lover YouTube Channel – Watch 400+ videos on lovemaking, healing after betrayal, intimacy techniques, and more.
- Susan’s Books & Programs – Including Sexual Soulmates, Relationship Magic, and Revive Her Drive: PersonalLifeMedia.com
- Longevity Tips & Biohacking for Sex Span: Longevity Wins Substack
- Susan on Instagram: @SusanBratton
- Threads: @susanbratton
- LinkedIn: Susan Bratton
- More Info: SusanBratton.com
Who This Episode is For:
- Women healing from infidelity or betrayal
- Couples wanting to reignite intimacy and passion
- Anyone curious about sex as a tool for healing, empowerment, and longevity
- Professionals interested in sexual biohacking and regenerative intimacy
Favorite Quote:
“Why let cheating cheat you of the pleasure that will extend your health span? When you extend your sex span, you extend your life.”
Subscribe, rate, and review FLAUNT! to help others uncover the power of radical self-worth and post-betrayal joy.
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About Lora:
Lora Cheadle, JD, CHt is a betrayal recovery coach, attorney, TEDx speaker, and author of FLAUNT! and It’s Not Burnout, It’s Betrayal.
After uncovering her husband’s 15-year affair, she turned her own pain into purpose—helping high-achieving women reclaim their identity, power, and joy.
A trauma-aware coach, somatic therapist, and former attorney, Lora blends legal insight with emotional and spiritual healing for full-spectrum recovery.
Learn more at LoraCheadle.com →
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Books By Lora
- International Book Award, Finalist Motivational Self-Help, 2021
- Tattered Cover Bestseller, 2019
Have you spent your life playing by the rules, only to realize those rules weren’t made for you? What if you could break free—from expectations, from betrayal, from the roles you were taught to play—and reclaim your true self?
FLAUNT! is your guide to stripping away societal conditioning, healing from the heartbreak of betrayal, and rediscovering the fierce, confident woman you were born to be. With humor, wisdom, and powerful, actionable steps, Lora Cheadle empowers you to rise above the narratives that have confined you and boldly choreograph a life that is smart, sexy, spiritual, and uniquely your own.
It’s time to stop living for others and start living for you.
Buy Now on Amazon, or wherever books are sold.
It’s Not Burnout, It’s Betrayal: 5 Tools to FUEL UP & Thrive
Burnout isn’t just exhaustion—it’s a betrayal of your time, energy, and trust. This essential guide redefines burnout, exposing its hidden roots and equipping individuals, teams, and leaders with five powerful tools to reclaim their passion, purpose, and well-being.
If you’re ready to break free from burnout and step into a life of clarity, confidence, and fulfillment, this book is your roadmap.
Available now on Amazon. Download your free guide, BURNOUT UNCOVERED: Fostering Candid Conversations for Teams at www.ItsNotBurnoutItsBetrayal.com.
Hashtags:
#BetrayalRecovery #SacredInitiation #HealingAfterInfidelity #ReclaimYourPower #TruthSetsYouFree #InfidelitySupport #FromBetrayalToBreakthrough #LoraCheadle #NakedSelfWorth #SpiritualHealing #RiseFromTheAshes #WomenWhoHeal #RadicalSelfTrust #TransformPainToPower #BetrayalUncovered
Keywords:
betrayal recovery, sexual biohacking, intimacy after infidelity, Susan Bratton interview, healing from cheating, somatic healing, libido after betrayal, open marriage, orgasm tips, yoni massage, soulmate embrace, nervous system regulation, desire, relationship communication, extending your sex span, sex over 50, polyamory healing
Transcript:
Lora Cheadle [00:00:02]:
Let’s talk about sex. Oh, my gosh. Sex is one of those things that I think a lot of us have a hard time talking about in the best of times. But then when we go through some sort of infidelity or betrayal, it becomes such a trigger because we have that thought. Did I do something wrong? Did I not know about it? Did he cheat because of me? Because. And then we spiral and we lose track of the fact that as the beautiful divine beings we are, we deserve pleasure, we deserve intimacy, we deserve deep, rich connection. That’s why I am so excited to bring Susan Bratton to you today. She is an intimacy expert to millions.
Lora Cheadle [00:00:48]:
She is a champion and an advocate for everyone who desires a passionate relationship. Now, whether you already know about her or you are going to learn about her today, you are going to be wowed. So sit down, pull out a pen and paper if you’re a note taker, and let’s get started. Welcome to the show, Susan.
Susan Bratton [00:01:13]:
Laura, I’ve been looking forward to talking to you. I was really pleased to see your request for me to appear on your show. Come in. Because I’ve been through quite a few, quite a bit of betrayal, and I have a lot of things that I want to share about it. And I really want to start with a story in thinking about some of the betrayal that I’ve been through. You know, I was thinking about betrayal and there are. There are people who betray you and you find a way to forgive them, and there are people who betray you and you realize that you just have to cut them out of your lives. And you know who they are, right? That’s.
Susan Bratton [00:01:55]:
There’s something about how you. What you need that tells you whether they’re a forgive and forget, move on and work through or a never talk to them again level of betrayal with a certain type of a personality. And I like to orient myself toward the forgive and forget because I would just prefer to give people grace for their imperfections, knowing I’m gonna be the next one to screw something up. I had a stepmother, she’s passed away now. And I didn’t have a good relationship with her, but she had other. She had children who were older than I. And one of her, her eldest son was an alcoholic. And I watched all through high school.
Susan Bratton [00:02:54]:
I watched her never give up on him. And though there were many things about her I didn’t like, I was really impressed with the fact that she didn’t throw him away because he had an alcoholic problem. He’s been sober now for 50 years. He met his wife in AA, she never gave up on him. And that was really impressive to me. But I’ve also equally had people who done me wrong and got the boot it. You know, there are some people that you realize that they didn’t just make dumb decisions, not have the tools and skills to deal with the issues, take the, take the, you know, kind of less best way out of a problem, not understand the long term implications of their actions. Actions have some wounding of their own that created an issue.
Susan Bratton [00:03:55]:
And then there are other people who are just going to be evil and you are not safe around them. And I really do respect both decisions. And just recently I had a bit of a betrayal and it affected four of us. And I was the one who harked back to my stepmother and said, this person made a mistake. We’re not going to die from this. We’re going to take lessons from this. But I’m not going to kick them out of the nest, remove my friendship from them for doing what they did, because I really actually understand why they did it. And it was a terrible, dumb mistake that put us all at risk.
Susan Bratton [00:04:37]:
That’s caused us to have a lot of repercussions from it. But in the grand scheme of things, we’ll live and they’ll learn and we’ll all learn to become better communicators. But I remember the very first time, you know, I got into being an intimacy expert because I had about 11 years into my marriage. It was our 11th anniversary, and I learned my lesson. I don’t have two gin martinis anymore, but I did that night. And I said to my husband in my drunkenness, I don’t, I, I’m not, I love you, but I’m not in love with you anymore. I’m not happy. And he said, me neither.
Susan Bratton [00:05:21]:
And we just looked at each other like, what are we going to do? We have a great platonic relationship. We have what ostensibly looks like the perfect marriage from the outside. We have a beautiful little girl together. We have great jobs. We have what looks like the perfect life and we’re miserable inside it because I’d never had an orgasm from intercourse. And I’d been making love with my husband for 11 years, 12 if you count the year before we got married. And I just avoided him for sex. I didn’t want to make love with him anymore.
Susan Bratton [00:05:53]:
And he tried everything, Laura. You know, he did the honeydews and the begging and the borrowing and the whining and the cajoling and the scheduling dates and, you know, everything he could think of because it wasn’t pleasurable for me, and it felt like an effort. I just was giving him mercy sex, and it was miserable for both of us. And ultimately, what came to light was, first we thought it was something with me that I just couldn’t do it. And then we realized, oh, no, we just don’t know what we’re doing. We started going to workshops and learning about lovemaking techniques and learning about pleasuring skills, and almost immediately, I became orgasmic. We just didn’t know what we didn’t know. But of course, we thought it was my fault.
Susan Bratton [00:06:39]:
Right, because that’s what people think. That was what was really the catalyst for me entering into the last two decades of this second career of my life, becoming a publisher of passionate lovemaking techniques and bedroom communication skills. Because if you don’t have the ability to talk about your sex life and these very vulnerable areas of your life, then all the techniques in the world ain’t gonna work. And what happened was, in the reparation process of that learning and coming back together, my husband had been having an affair that I didn’t know about. And honestly, when I looked back on it, he was doing it to cope with the situation that he was in. But at the. When I found out, he had gone to a therapist, and the therapist said, tim, you have to tell her, like, no matter what’s going to happen, you have to come clean about this. That’s not right.
Susan Bratton [00:07:35]:
And he told me. And I can remember the burning shame that I felt when I grew up. I was not supposed to or allowed to cry. So I have a difficulty accessing my tears. I don’t come to tears easily. I have some girlfriends, man, they’ll cry at everything. They’re such good criers. I’m the worst crier.
Susan Bratton [00:08:00]:
And so when he told me that, I remember, I. I had to go out and I had to pull over on the side of the road in a. In a. A firehouse parking lot. And the sobs that came out of me were like the sobs that had been suppressed from every crying suppression I’d ever had in my life. I cried and cried and cried and cried, and. And I just, like. It was like, vomiting, upset, you know? And I thought to myself, why do I feel ashamed? When he cheated? Yes.
Susan Bratton [00:08:38]:
I was so surprised that shame was what I felt. Not anger, not denial, not victimhood. Shame. Like, it’s our job, and we fail when our partner cheats, which is not true. It’s just the misogynistic, patriarchal culture in which we all swim. So I remember that. Do you know the work of Byron Katie?
Lora Cheadle [00:09:05]:
Absolutely.
Susan Bratton [00:09:06]:
Okay. Byron’s incredible.
Lora Cheadle [00:09:07]:
She’s amazing.
Susan Bratton [00:09:08]:
And I had. I was talking to a lot of people at the time. I was going to a therapist. We were going to. I was working with a Byron Katie therapist at one point. And my. My girl, my chiropractor, who was my best friend, she said, call this woman and just talk to her. Just have a session with her.
Susan Bratton [00:09:27]:
And she said to me, oh, honey, he didn’t do this to you. This doesn’t even really have much to do with you. He did this to stay in the marriage with you 100%. My God. That was what I needed to hear of all the things. And it was so interesting, too. I bet, Laura, I bet you’re gonna be like, yep, I hear this one, too. We went to a marriage and family therapist, and we talked about the issues we’re having with our sex life and my.
Susan Bratton [00:10:06]:
My lack of desire. And. And the therapist said, well, you know, this is just what happens in monogamous relationships. She said this to my husband. This is. This is just kind of what you have to get used to. We walked out of there, and my husband was like, I’m never going. So then we go to another therapist, and.
Susan Bratton [00:10:26]:
And he was like, I want to have sex every day. I want sex every day. And she said, oh, you’re a sex addict. You need to go to Sex Addicts Anonymous. S a a And so he tried. He thought, well, maybe I’m a sex addict, right? So he went to sex saa and he comes home and he’s like, I’m not a sex addict. Those people are sex addicts. I mean, like, they pass out.
Susan Bratton [00:10:55]:
They do drugs in hotels and pass out watching porn and end up with hookers and blow and, you know, like, all this stuff. And he’s like, I don’t have any of these compulsions. I just want to be close to you every day. And so the thing that really helped us was going to these intimacy workshops and learning the techniques, and suddenly it was like, the easiest thing in the world. We started having great sex. So over time, I learned how to understand what happened. The dynamics, the reparations, the apologies, all of the things that happened, and that really helped me.
Lora Cheadle [00:11:37]:
Yes.
Susan Bratton [00:11:37]:
Fast forward 20 years by this time that those reparations had made us realize that we were so good in bed together. We learned how to have great sex, and we became fantastic lovers. And then we wanted to have relationships with other people, too. We wanted to try this, you know, poly thing, right? So we opened up our marriage. We always played together, and we went through a lot of learning. And one of the women who came into our relationship came into our relationship right around Covid. And I got Covid very badly. And I have some genetic issues with some certain things where it took me out.
Susan Bratton [00:12:25]:
I was down. And this was right when my husband had met a new woman. And I encouraged them to have a good time because I was too sick to do anything. And I was glad he had the company. And they fed me and took care of me for a year and a half while I got through it. But they fell in love and they got really close. And I kept saying, I’m lonely, guys. I’m lonely.
Susan Bratton [00:12:45]:
I feel left out. And they’re like, well, you can be with us. And I was like, I don’t really want to. It’s not my thing. And they were like, well, get a new partner now that you feel better. And I’m like, okay, but I still feel lonely. Like that’s not the solution. And I just got this inkling that that woman was going to try to steal my husband like the last one did 20 years ago.
Susan Bratton [00:13:07]:
The reason he was saying that I want sex every day to the therapist was that first relationship, the cheating one, she was saying to him, I would give you sex every day. You should leave her. You know, you should definitely leave her. She’s no good for you. She’s never going to give you what you want. You should come with me. So she tried to steal him away, and I fought her tooth and nail. So the second one, I’m like, she’s going to try to steal my husband.
Susan Bratton [00:13:35]:
And lo and behold, she did. I was right. And he had fallen so deeply in love with her. And this is what people worry about with polyamorous and open relationships and consensual non monogamy is that they don’t want somebody stealing their partner. Right, Right. It is a reasonable concern. Now, what happened was that it took me a couple of years for him to get out of his, you know, falling in love head and realized that he was going to lose the woman he had spent more of his life with than not. We’ve been together longer than we haven’t.
Susan Bratton [00:14:13]:
We have had our 34 years together. We met when I was 30, so he was under the spell of this other person and she was manipulating him. And I could see it. Not everybody’s as nice as you and I are, right? Not everybody plays fair. A lot of people play dirty as they can. One day I got home One day I left for a business trip, and I said after he promised he was no longer going to see her, and he had stumbled a few times, and men are so easy to manipulate. Oh, my God.
Lora Cheadle [00:14:50]:
So easy.
Susan Bratton [00:14:51]:
As, you know, I mean, their little head has no control, so. And I hate to make excuses for them, like, they should be better, right? But you got to deal with what is not what you want, right?
Lora Cheadle [00:15:04]:
Right.
Susan Bratton [00:15:05]:
So I’m leaving for a business trip, and we’re right on the edge where I still don’t trust him. He’s betrayed me repeatedly. She’s tried to come back, and I said, she monitors my social media. She’s gonna come to the door. I had made him get new cameras and new locks. I made him change the locks, and I made him get new cameras because I didn’t trust him.
Lora Cheadle [00:15:21]:
No.
Susan Bratton [00:15:21]:
And it was because I didn’t trust her either. And I said, she’s going to see him traveling because I’m going to post something on socials. And don’t let her in the house. Don’t open the door. What’s he do? She shows up. He opens the door. She comes in, she moves him out of my house. Now, how did he.
Susan Bratton [00:15:45]:
He could have stopped it. No, he can’t. He could not stop it. She knew exactly how to manipulate him. And what’s interesting is I could manipulate my husband. I can manipulate the crap out of my husband, but I’m a woman of integrity. My job is to love and care and protect him for his. The things that make him so easy to manipulate.
Susan Bratton [00:16:02]:
He is a genius, a darling man, a wonderful husband, but he’s got some weak spots that can be exploited. So lo and behold, I get home to an empty house. All this stuff is gone. I go, I drive over, I call him, and I’m like, I’m coming to get you. Put all the stuff outside. I’m bringing the SUV and we’re going home. I went and I got him and I brought him home. And I said, I will fight you to the death for him.
Susan Bratton [00:16:30]:
You will not get him. There’s no way. You better give up now. You’re no match for me, and you’re going to lose. He’s my husband. He’s my father of my child. He’s my business partner in two businesses. I am completely and totally in love with him.
Susan Bratton [00:16:44]:
And. And he is completely and totally in love with me. And I don’t exploit him like you do. And he will know that. And so it was quite interesting to go through both of those experiences with him. And be more in love with him than ever. But the healing journey that we went through was, was a very important one for me and how we did it and how we’re still doing it even to this day.
Lora Cheadle [00:17:11]:
I’m glad you said that.
Susan Bratton [00:17:12]:
More of that with you as well. But I wanted to tell you, I wanted to just give you a couple of examples of betrayal. And there have been many. And not just all sexual and not just all relational. We’re betrayed all the time by many, many people. This is part of life.
Lora Cheadle [00:17:26]:
Right? Right. It’s something that we don’t identify as betrayal. We just think, oh, something really bad happened and then we don’t heal it. And that’s what I loved so much that you said, I am still on this healing journey because there’s been a lot packed in there and there’s a lot to unpack and it’s not like, oh, I healed on Thursday at 2 o’, clock, so now I’m good. That’s not a thing. And yes, absolutely, I want to talk about healing, but before we move into that, there are several points that I want to kind of foot stomp, unpack, just so people hear. One, the idea that we’re supposed to know how to have sex, the idea that it’s just supposed to be natural and innate and we’re going to connect and do it. That’s not a thing.
Lora Cheadle [00:18:08]:
That is not a thing. My question to you, everybody in the audience, where did you learn how to have sex? You probably just had it and then maybe your girlfriend told you something or a partner told you something. But that’s not education. Get yourself educated. I don’t care how old you are, how many partners you have or have not had. Learn some things. Even if you learn that, you don’t need to learn anything. And that’s not a thing either.
Susan Bratton [00:18:35]:
No, that’s not. No, you need to learn.
Lora Cheadle [00:18:38]:
You need to learn.
Susan Bratton [00:18:40]:
This is what I do. I teach passionate lovemaking techniques and I’m terribly censored, so it’s very hard to find these things. Porn is easy to find patriarchal perspectives on the way sex looks. Easy. Every movie look is based on male male gaze and male arousal patterns, not women. Yeah, so it’s. And, and you can procreate, but you can’t make love unless you know what you’re doing. So I’d like to give myself a plug right here.
Lora Cheadle [00:19:03]:
Yes.
Susan Bratton [00:19:04]:
BetterLover.com is where I have my newsletter. If you go to betterlover.com and you get on my newsletter, I send out two newsletters a week with pleasuring techniques, bedroom communication skills. Really fun little quizzes you can take to learn more about your sexual personality types, your sex life, bucket list ideas, things like that. And I would recommend you get on that because you’ll be surprised that every single email you’re like, I did not know that. I did not know that. Wow. Wow. I’m learning so much.
Susan Bratton [00:19:34]:
So that’s the. That is exactly right. We’re not taught because we live in a repressed society.
Lora Cheadle [00:19:40]:
Yeah, absolutely. And the second thing that I want to point out, because this comes up a lot, people will find out their partner has an affair, is having an affair, and the partner will say, let’s just open up the marriage, then it’s not cheating. That’s. That’s not a thing either.
Susan Bratton [00:19:55]:
That’s not the time to do it.
Lora Cheadle [00:19:57]:
No, no. You need communication. And open marriage is something you communicate about in advance. You don’t just say, oh, let’s open up the marriage, and then it’s okay.
Susan Bratton [00:20:07]:
Yeah.
Lora Cheadle [00:20:07]:
If that’s a choice you want to make, it’s made after. Just like you did after the initial affair. Recovery. Healing has happened.
Susan Bratton [00:20:15]:
Yes. Long after.
Lora Cheadle [00:20:17]:
Yes.
Susan Bratton [00:20:17]:
When the trust has returned.
Lora Cheadle [00:20:19]:
Yes. Yeah. Yes. So I wanted to comment on those two issues before we moved on and. Yes. Let’s talk about healing. What. What does mean somatically? What does that mean intellectually? What does that mean relationally? Let’s talk about that.
Susan Bratton [00:20:37]:
Yeah. One of the. One of the things that I’ve realized in my relational dynamics is that my male partner processes things at a glacial pace. Emotions are so distant for him. And I think this is very typical for the male versus female partners. For me, I’m a pretty fast adjuster, and I’m able to kind of masticate my emotions pretty well. I think part of the reason is that I got very lucky. I grew up in the 60s and I was raised by a feminist mother who told me that I was really smart and made great decisions and that I should always trust my gut and that I could make better decisions for myself than anyone else could and to believe in myself.
Susan Bratton [00:21:28]:
And I don’t think that a lot of people get that. I actually think that’s quite rare. And so I’ve always trusted my gut, which has been really, I think, honestly, one of the most beautiful gifts I’ve been given in my life. So I think I’m a fast adjuster. And I’ve also noticed that there are a lot of people who are very slow adjusters. They’re not always men but men seem to have. Their emotions are more distant, they have difficulty putting them into words, and therefore it takes them a lot longer to move through to healing. And I know that one of the most important things that I’ve had to do in both these experiences has been to be the utmost of patient.
Susan Bratton [00:22:17]:
People want to fix problems quickly because they hurt. And I have learned. And I think this came from my career in Silicon Valley, where early in my 20s, I started working for myself, and then in my 30s, I worked in Silicon Valley. And it’s constantly changing. There’s, we’re growing, we’re acquiring, we’re laying off, we’re changing business strategies. Oh, my company went out. I gotta get a new job. You learn to have.
Susan Bratton [00:22:44]:
You learn to be able to sustain uncertainty. And I think being able to live in the process and in uncertainty and to be able to hold that sensation is very good practice for also becoming a great lover and enjoying your sexuality. Because what’s the very first thing that 90% of sex therapists tell their couples to do? To stay in sensation, to feel what’s going on, to get out of your head and into your body so that you can feel more pleasure. So when these things are really well connected. Because if you’re able to sustain uncertainty, you’ll also be really good at the mindfulness practice of pleasure and connection. Sex is a mindfulness practice as well. And so when you can do those crossing the chasms, whether that’s closing the orgasm gap, learning how to orgasm from intercourse, or any of the other types of orgasms, which are all. All learned skills, by the way, maybe you found one path to orgasm, but there are, you know, unlimited paths to pleasure.
Susan Bratton [00:23:55]:
Your body is a massively orgasmic thing. And the orgasms are a very, very important part of rebooting the nervous system, improving your heart connection, generating oxytocin, lowering anxiety, improving immune function, increasing your vascular performance, heightening your cognitive function, there are, and I. There are 25 other things, you know, hormone cascades and neurotransmitter release. And there’s so many good things about it that I think being orgasmic takes mindfulness and recovering from betrayal takes mindfulness because it’s a slog. The former is a pleasure, but the latter is a slog. And you got to be willing to, to get, be up for it. So I think that’s important as well.
Lora Cheadle [00:24:47]:
Yeah, it is. And the idea, it’s such a juxtaposition. I want to have this amazing sex. I have been without connection to the level that I have wanted I have maybe struggled with this. Things have been busy. My partner was distant because he was cheating, and I didn’t know he was cheating. I want that now, but I’m so angry. I’m so hurt.
Lora Cheadle [00:25:10]:
I’m so uncertain. Talk. Let’s talk about how do you have sex and still not maybe be certain about that person? How can you reconcile all of that and still stay in integrity?
Susan Bratton [00:25:24]:
Yes. There’s a couple of things I’d recommend and remember that I’m. I’m only working with my own nervous system, my own level of evolution, my own genetic snip profile, you know, my epigenetics. Because one of the things that I noticed, and I’m going to answer your question because I think it’s probably that it’s. It’s the jewel in the crown of this segment for us is how you manage through that. And I want to. But there’s something I want to say before I say it, which will help when I explain it, and that is that one of the most common things that I deal with is what is called mismatched libido, but is really not libido. Libido is your health.
Susan Bratton [00:26:04]:
Desire is your emotion, and arousal is your body’s climb to turn on. And they get kind of used together. And of course, when you’re upset, your libido is going to be low because you’re having emotional and physical responses to the upset and the betrayal. But the desire is also. You feel like you’ve been hurt and you’ve been treated disrespectfully. I mean, the disrespect is very difficult. And then you have arousal issues because of both those things. So you’ve got this triple whammy that you’re trying to get back from.
Susan Bratton [00:26:52]:
And one of the things that happens most is this, this idea that couples, that couples talk to me. You know, one of the partners will say to me, I just, we just don’t have sex. It’s like we’ve hit a wall. We’ve just stopped. We just stopped having sex. How can I get back to having sex? And step one is identifying what it is that happened and how it’s affecting you. And I remember one time I sent out an A request to my email newsletter readers, and there’s over 300,000 of them. It’s a large group.
Susan Bratton [00:27:27]:
And I said, I won’t be able to get back to everyone, but please tell me, what’s the reason that you are no longer intimate with your partner? And when they replied, I had 700800 replies. And Maurice, who has been work with me for 15 years in my care team, she’s very good at analytics too. And one of my talents is being able to look at a wide variety of information and net it down into simple things. What I realized was that about 80% of the responses were physical issues. Cancer, erectile dysfunction, you know, all of these kinds of things. 20% were betrayal. And it was the betrayal people that were having the most difficult part. They couldn’t forgive, they couldn’t get over it.
Susan Bratton [00:28:16]:
And one day I was, I was on a podcast that was with the DNA company. They measure your genetic snips and tell you what your SNPs are. And I said, one of the things that I found in dealing with people with sexual betrayal is that they have this thing where every time they think about it, it’s like Groundhog Day. They can’t move through it because they get swamped with the feelings of the betrayal. And it’s like this opened gash that’s just bleeding out of them all the time. Why do some. It’s about 20% of the 20%. Why do some people have this wound that won’t heal? And how do other people heal their wounds? And Cash said something very interesting to me.
Susan Bratton [00:29:05]:
He said, it’s serotonin pathways, genetic snips. He says, here’s what I think it is. And I was like, oh yeah, this totally explains it. Serotonin will make you relive events like they’re fresh. And if you have specific genetic snips where every time you remember the memory, it feels like fresh wound versus someone who can remember the memory and it heals over time. You’re kind of stuck in this Groundhog Day of betrayal. And I thought, oh, that’s so interesting. So those are the real 20% of the 20% of people who need your help the most.
Susan Bratton [00:29:37]:
They need to have a lot of functional processing to get through it. And it has to be very dimensional. It has to be body, mind, spirit, relational, individual. It has to come from things in your past. It has to project into your future. It’s dimensional. Yes. Where other people like me can look at it and I can be like, I understand why you did it.
Susan Bratton [00:30:00]:
I understand what happened. I love him and I’m, you know, yeah, I’m friggin pissed at him. He’s a dumb. A dumb dumb, exactly. But I love him and I’m going to come through this. And so that’s one of the things that I wanted to posit, is that for me, I Still felt all that anger, resentment, betrayal and disgust and. And disrespect and like, are you again? Come on. She’s.
Susan Bratton [00:30:34]:
Oh, Pete. You know, but when I would get back into that bedroom, every time I had a deal with him, and I said, every time I go into the catastrophizing, when I’m not staying present, I’m going to tell you, and if I need to stop, I’m going to stop, stop. And we’ll start again later or the next day or the day after. But I’m not going to stuff one iota of my feelings about this.
Lora Cheadle [00:31:03]:
Yeah.
Susan Bratton [00:31:04]:
Every single time it comes up in and out of the bedroom, I’m going to say, right at this moment, I’m still pissed off at you. Or right at this moment, I’m still feeling so sad about what happened or whatever it is. And so I think the noticing and saying and getting, for me, my processing comes by speaking it out. Why do I do so many podcasts? I think by talking.
Lora Cheadle [00:31:28]:
Yes.
Susan Bratton [00:31:29]:
That’s how I process. That’s not how everyone processes. Some people. Some people have a trouble that’s like, so buried in them. Other people, it’s right here, but they can think it. I can’t think it. I have to say it to get it out. So I think it’s really good to understand how you process emotion so that.
Susan Bratton [00:31:46]:
That helps your processing process.
Lora Cheadle [00:31:48]:
Yes.
Susan Bratton [00:31:50]:
But every time it came up, I said things, and I honestly feel like that really helped him get some dimensionality around his actions and how it affected me so that he could move toward forgiving himself and helping me forgive him and me forgiving myself for things that I did wrong. I’ll give you a really good example, and I think this is very interesting, but you tell me what you think, and I’d love your feedback on this as well. And I promise I’m getting to the body stuff. So when. When I h. When I say things out loud, lets it go for me. It really lets it go for me so I can move on where I feel like there are other people that when they say it out loud, it makes it bigger for them. What have you found about that when you’re working with people around betrayal?
Lora Cheadle [00:32:52]:
I. I’m glad you asked that. I have found that people who have been betrayed have a very high need to be witnessed. They need to have their pain witness. They need to have their suffering witnessed. They need to have this experience witnessed. And there is a difference between having it memorialized. Like, we will always go back to the memorial of betrayal and we’re all going to gather around and we’re going to feel bad.
Lora Cheadle [00:33:16]:
That’s not what we want. But we need it witnessed and we need it held. And we need that pathway forward to be lit, whether it’s lit by a professional, whether it’s lit by our friends, whether we learn to light that path forward ourselves. But unless and until we are witness, it’s always going to come up because it’s this, feed me, feed me, feed me. I went through the worst thing in my life and by God, I need to be seen in that.
Susan Bratton [00:33:45]:
Yeah. Yep. It really feels good to process it that way for me. So it was interesting too, because the magic pill method was what I created from that question to all of those people. I came up with a five step process for helping people talk through what was holding them back from having good intimacy. Again, whether it was physical, emotional, and it’s always a combination when everything physical has an emotional component and a spiritual component too. And what I found was that couples didn’t feel like they were on a level playing field. He felt like she could talk circles around him.
Susan Bratton [00:34:30]:
And that’s very common, you know, like the man of few words type of thing. Distant in their emotion. We don’t raise our little boys to really have access to their emotions and process them in the ways that we allow our little girls to do it. And so the magic pill method, which is@magicpill method.com is a downloadable, free downloadable PDF that essentially helps you make a list of what you used to do that you miss, what you can know you feel you can no longer do, and what’s broken that could be fixed so that you could move some things from the I don’t think I can do it anymore to I think I can do it again. And that’s where you get into intimate wellness and sexual biohacking and regenerative therapies, which is. We suffer from erectile dysfunction, both men and women. We suffer from loss of sensation, inability to have orgasmic pleasure, we suffer from atrophy, we suffer from loss of lubrication, we suffer from prostate issues, we suffer from incontinence issues, we suffer from fissures and all kinds of things. All of those things can be fixed 98% of the time through regenerative therapies and treatments.
Susan Bratton [00:35:50]:
And so we can move people who no longer have sex because they think sex is only intercourse, because that’s how they’ve been raised. Sexist for making babies. So the only thing that matters is intercourse to, oh, intimacy and pleasure in Orgasm is actually kissing, full body touch, breast play, oral pleasuring, manual pleasuring and penetrative, you know, experiences. And so when I get people to start making the list of things they still could do together, that tends to get everything kick started. Because what happens is when people hit a roadblock like betrayal or illness, they literally, because they have this mindset that sex is intercourse. And now I’m not going to do intercourse. I’m never going to touch my partner again. We’re going to sleep in separate beds, we barely hold hands, we just sit on the couch side by side.
Susan Bratton [00:36:42]:
Now we’re just parallel, platonically playing at our life rather than having one of the beautiful gifts of our health and our health span. There is a, a concept I like to use called the fourth factor. Everybody’s perfectly happy to talk about their sleep score on their aura ring and how important sleep hygiene is. They’re happy to talk about how good, good exercise is for longevity, and they’re happy to talk about how good nutrition is for longevity. But the fourth unspoken factor, because of all the censorship and repression in our society, is intimate pleasure. Intimate orgasmic pleasure. And I already gave you, your listeners, the list of that’s not even all of the benefits of intimate pleasure, when you shut that down instead of walk yourself back into that connection, first of all, you don’t get over the betrayal at a level that you should and could, and I do say should, and I’m not saying should a lot on things. I think people get to do what they want to do.
Susan Bratton [00:37:47]:
But my goodness, why let this cheat? Why let cheating cheat you of the pleasure that’s going to extend your health span? Because when you extend your sex span, you extend, extend your health span. People who have intimacy, and I mean orgasmic pleasure into their old age live literally. Studies from all over the world have proven this. They live a longer, healthier, happier life. The couple that’s in parallel and aged but no longer intimate versus the couple that’s still kicking it in their 80s and 90s. You know, those are entirely different people with entirely different levels of passion and vitality and a zest for life because they have not just lust, but lust for life from keeping it going. So if there’s anything I could, I could really imbue with import in our conversation, it is that you have to get back in the bedroom. You have to learn how to start over.
Susan Bratton [00:38:55]:
You have to try new things together. Sometimes the best thing to do is a pattern interrupt where instead of just going to the go to things you’ve Relied on in the pathways that have worked in the past. Begin in this moment to create new neural pathways to pleasure together by cross training stimulation. Try Yoni massage and Lingam massage. Try introducing toys. Try my soulmate embrace technique. This is a very good thing for emotional reparation. It’s@soulmateembrace.com and it is a.
Susan Bratton [00:39:37]:
If you’re a woman listening, print this out and hand this to your male partner and say I would like to practice this with you. This is what I think I need. If you are the male partner, opt in, download, print it out, read it and suggest that you do this to your woman. Because it is essentially a grounding and heart reconnection practice where your man holds you in his arms for an extended period of time. And what interesting is I tell him exactly how to hold her, exactly what’s going to come up for her, how it’s going to get emotions out, how he can hold space for all of that, why his grounding masculine energy is going to help her move through the traumas and it’s going to help him recenter and ground himself and bring you back together as a couple. So you can do the next things which might be kissing or full body touch or genital massage. The Yoni and Lingam massage, these are tantric love making words for our genital parts. Yoni is hers, lingam is his and they’re nicer than the anatomical terms for the genital structures.
Susan Bratton [00:40:55]:
So when you begin with the soulmate embrace, she’s going to have some things that come up for her. It’s going to move her emotion and when you can help her move her emotion, it will help you clear yours and come back to stasis and connection. So the soulmate embrace is a very powerful technique. It also co creates oxytocin. And the interesting thing about oxytocin is that oxytocin is not just the bonding mother baby bonding or the love hormone. What it actually is is a hormone that makes you feel awe, it makes you feel appreciation for the beauty of life, it makes you less annoyed with other people, you have more capacity when you have more oxytocin and when you’re nervous and upset, you’re spiking cortisol and oxytocin is the antidote to that. And being held is the way to generate it. So being held frequently will be the thing that allows you to let the emotions bubble up and get off your chest so you can move forward and then learning some of these new things like lingam and yoni massage are very, very good because they help you reconnect your limbic system, which helps you reconnect your nervous systems and begin to co regulate together.
Susan Bratton [00:42:28]:
After all the dysregulation that’s been created from the betrayal. So the spaciousness to allow yourself to say what you need to say for your partner to be able to witness and hold it and hear it will help you move through this period really beautifully.
Lora Cheadle [00:42:50]:
And thank you for bringing that all together because there are so many things that I hear repeatedly. One is, I don’t know what I want. I don’t know how to do this. But what if this happens and it’s all just nervous system dysregulation? And you know what? Once you re regulate, that’s when you can figure out this is what I want. I do love the life we’ve built. I do want things to get better. I want more intimacy. I want more pleasure.
Lora Cheadle [00:43:17]:
And if the decision you make also is wow, from this regulated, centered space where I have access to my own pleasure, again, I know in my heart that this isn’t the person for me. That is an empowered stance as well. And you are moving on as two healthier, more healed, happy whole people, which is going to be good for both of you. If you’ve got children together, that’s going to be good for you.
Susan Bratton [00:43:44]:
Yeah.
Lora Cheadle [00:43:45]:
And if you stay together, this is just the beginning. How exciting. What can we move into going forward? What can I access within myself? And you had used that how to sustain uncertainty. Look at the political, economic times that we’re in. One day the market’s up, one day it’s down. One day this is happening. We do need to know how to sustain uncertainty and whether it is betrayal from our partner or whether it’s a cancer diagnosis, how do we sustain that uncertainty and why? And how can intimacy help us learn how to sustain that for our health, for our pleasure, for our joy. So thank you for so beautifully integrating all the whys.
Lora Cheadle [00:44:29]:
It’s not just we’re horny and we’re going to get off. There’s a reason for this that even goes deeper than that.
Susan Bratton [00:44:36]:
Yeah. It’s emotional resolution. Yeah. It’s conjoined reparation. Yeah, it definitely is. Remind me the URL to your fantastic download that I just read yesterday.
Lora Cheadle [00:44:51]:
Yes, thank you. It’s betrayalrecoveryguide.com I loved your ebook.
Susan Bratton [00:44:56]:
I thought it was an excellent. Step by step, you really laid out the process to get through this. And for all of the people who aren’t listening to Your show. Those are the people I feel bad for because they don’t even know how to work through this and get. Not only get through it and repair, but to feel more mature and more resourceful when it happens again, because things are going to. Whether it’s your partner or somebody else or a work thing or whatever. Betrayal is a part of life. And so having the coping mechanisms and the way that you teach people to get through betrayal is so important.
Susan Bratton [00:45:39]:
It’s funny how I think it’s such a. It’s such an upsetting situation for people because they don’t have the tools to do it, that they avoid it. They stuff it, and they don’t handle it, and then they carry it.
Lora Cheadle [00:45:56]:
Yes.
Susan Bratton [00:45:57]:
And, I mean, there are still. Every once in a while, something will come up for me with my husband, I just say it like it’s his job to hold that. Like that’s what he. That’s his learning, too. We have experiences where we learn from our mistakes. And he knows I love him. He knows I’ll never want him to go away, but he also knows that, you know, he screwed some. And.
Susan Bratton [00:46:23]:
And I may screw some things up. I screw. I just screwed up different things. I just screwed up different things. Not that thing.
Lora Cheadle [00:46:29]:
Yeah. Yeah. I also really appreciate when you talked about. I went after him and I brought him home. You went for what you wanted. And so many of us, especially in this patriarchal, misogynistic culture, feel like I am the victim. I can’t go for what I want. I can’t speak up and thank you for giving people permission.
Lora Cheadle [00:46:50]:
Even if it doesn’t work out, you are absolutely entitled to go for what you want. And one of the stories that I have told before, and I’m gonna tell it again, too, I was a corporate attorney for 10 years. I advocated on behalf of everybody else. But when something would happen to me, I’d be like, oh, it’s okay. Oh, it’s fine. And it was this whole shift that I had to realize, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. I get to decide what I want, and I get to go after it. And if it doesn’t work, that’s okay.
Lora Cheadle [00:47:19]:
But I don’t need anybody’s permission. And if something happens, that’s. I don’t want to say it’s okay, but it’s okay, and I still have control. So thank you for saying I can do this. I’m going after it.
Susan Bratton [00:47:33]:
I want to add one more thing, and it’s boundaries. So boundaries are very interesting. And that’s what you were just Talking about. You were talking about getting your boundaries breached. And one of the things that I’ve learned now in my advanced age, I’m in my mid. I turned 64 today, this week.
Lora Cheadle [00:47:49]:
Happy birthday.
Susan Bratton [00:47:50]:
Thank you. And I’m having the best sex of my life at 64. I’ve never been juicier, more orgasmic and had more pleasure and depth of connection and joy in my sex life or my whole life. So don’t worry, things don’t have to get worse. That’s a mindset. That’s someone else’s agenda. Not my agenda, but one of the things that I learned about boundaries in betrayal. Remember when I was saying, I’m lonely, you guys, I feel left out.
Susan Bratton [00:48:21]:
You know when I was saying those things?
Lora Cheadle [00:48:22]:
Yes.
Susan Bratton [00:48:23]:
And they were like, well, you know, you could be with that. I was like, I don’t want to. That’s not what’s right for me. I wanted my husband to pay more attention to me. I was fine with him being in a poly relationship. I didn’t need all the attention. I’d like him to have experiences and joy, I really do. But it was too one sided and I was feeling left out.
Susan Bratton [00:48:41]:
But he was falling in love with her, which I also understood. And I thought, well, you know, he really just, he’s having this opportunity and I can’t give him everything he needs because I’m too ill. And I understand that. I’m going to let him have a good time. But when I said I wasn’t happy and they didn’t immediately adjust, then I should have been more insistent. And I feel like I was very insistent about it. And yet he doesn’t remember it that way. He’s like, I don’t, I don’t even really remember that.
Susan Bratton [00:49:11]:
And I was like, right, because you were in your, you were in your love brain and you weren’t paying attention to me. You were holding me together by feeding me food, but you weren’t putting your attention on me. You were falling in love. And it got worse and worse and worse until it came to a head. And what I realized was that instead of allowing my boundaries to get breached, that I need to just. When my boundaries get breached, I need to really put a point on it. Like stop, drop and be like, let me explain exactly what’s going on here for me. Let’s talk about this and work it out.
Susan Bratton [00:49:52]:
Instead of just kind of like saying, I’m not happy. I don’t like this. This isn’t good. I’m worried. I feel left out. I don’t feel like this is right. This isn’t going in the right direction. I didn’t say enough of that.
Susan Bratton [00:50:07]:
Enough stridently, enough strongly enough for them to get it. To do something about it, because I did. I was. I was allowing my boundaries to get breached. It wasn’t their fault. That was me. And what I’ve learned is that people think about boundaries. Like, it’s like, I’m putting up a fence between you and I.
Susan Bratton [00:50:31]:
This is my boundary. It’s like, don’t cross this boundary. But I don’t think about boundaries that way anymore. And I actually think it’s kind of a dumb name. What I think boundaries are. Are rules for how to love me really well.
Lora Cheadle [00:50:47]:
Oh, I like that so much better.
Susan Bratton [00:50:49]:
Me too. And we should come up with something like, you know, like. Like whatever it might be, like, love steps. Or, you know, like, what I really want are you to take these love steps that I need. And when you’re not taking these love steps, it’s hurting me. And when you take those love steps, then I know you love me. When you don’t take those love steps, I don’t know if you love me. Like, if we had it that way and we just replaced the words from boundaries, boundaries makes it seem like I need to have this thing and you better give it to me when that’s not at all what they are.
Susan Bratton [00:51:29]:
So I like to rework that whole idea. And I like to remind people how important it is to not allow your boundaries to get breached. Right.
Lora Cheadle [00:51:37]:
Right. And again, you have permission to do that. You have permission. You have permission to say, to do. To take action. Because nobody is going to advocate on behalf of you except you. I mean, I really wish there was somebody following me around saying, no, no, no, no, no. You disrespected her.
Lora Cheadle [00:51:58]:
And people would say, oh, my gosh, you’re the ultimate authority. But that’s not how it works, sadly.
Susan Bratton [00:52:04]:
We are the ultimate authority. Yeah. Individually, for ourselves, we are the ultimate authority for ourselves.
Lora Cheadle [00:52:09]:
Yes. Which ties us right back to when you were talking about the way you got raised. Just your gut. Nobody can make a better decision for you than you. And whatever it is, if you call it universe, if you call it spirit, if you call it inner knowing, I don’t care what you call it. Go within. The body knows. Yes, the mind is going to trip you up.
Lora Cheadle [00:52:33]:
But move from the head to the heart to the gut, what do. What do those different body parts say? We all know. I know you know. And if you need permission, you can ask me. You can ask Susan. You can have somebody and we’ll say, oh, you have permission to do that. But, you know, so listen, trust yourself. Make decisions on your own behalf because.
Susan Bratton [00:52:58]:
In your own best interest.
Lora Cheadle [00:52:59]:
Yes. Nobody can do that for you, because.
Susan Bratton [00:53:02]:
If they love you, they want what’s best for you, too.
Lora Cheadle [00:53:05]:
Yeah. And the thing is, too, if they don’t love you, isn’t that good to know?
Susan Bratton [00:53:11]:
Yes. Yeah. If they’re not willing to do what you need to feel safe, secure, and loved, then they’re not the person for you. And that is when you move, you move on and you let them go. And there are people who make mistakes and they did the best they could do, and they’re not perfect. And there are people who make mistakes, and you know that they would do it again if they could get away with it. And that’s your determinant.
Lora Cheadle [00:53:32]:
Yes. Yes. It’s not hard to decide whether to stay or whether to go. It’s hard sometimes to figure out how to figure it out. But that’s.
Susan Bratton [00:53:40]:
Yeah. Or to get out. How to figure out how to get out.
Lora Cheadle [00:53:43]:
Yeah.
Susan Bratton [00:53:43]:
That’s also intertwined. That is a hard part to dissect. Yes.
Lora Cheadle [00:53:48]:
Yeah. And, you know, I’m putting a bug out here because I feel like we need a whole other hour on aging and intimacy because there’s. There’s a lot. There’s the mindset, there’s the physiological, and I. I love your work around biohacking and also just around. You don’t have to stop having sex.
Susan Bratton [00:54:06]:
Oh, no. It gets better and better.
Lora Cheadle [00:54:09]:
Yes. So please know that that’s out there. And please know that even though you might not have had great sex up until now.
Susan Bratton [00:54:16]:
Oh, it’s just the beginning.
Lora Cheadle [00:54:17]:
It’s just the beginning.
Susan Bratton [00:54:18]:
I was 42 before I had my first orgasm. From intercourse.
Lora Cheadle [00:54:21]:
Yeah.
Susan Bratton [00:54:22]:
You know, it just takes time, really. I think we, you know, sex keeps getting better your whole life long, just like all the other things you master. It’s just a part of mastering. My cooking has never been better. I mean, everybody wants to come over to my house and get a meal because my cooking is delicious and so is my sex life. It’s the same. I’ve practiced it for 30 or 40 years.
Lora Cheadle [00:54:46]:
Exactly. Exactly. So where else can people learn about you? Learn about all the incredible downloads you have. I’m going to put all the ones that you mentioned in the show notes, but thank you. There’s a lot here. So where else?
Susan Bratton [00:54:57]:
Oh, I know I have a lot of things. Most of them are free, which is nice. Well, I think betterlover.com is, is really the Rosetta Stone and it has a lot of my videos searchable on that website and they’re all free. And that’s a nice place where you can just put in things like betrayal, sexual healing, yoni massage, passionate love making, you know, anything that, anything that I said, magic pill method, you know, any of the soulmate embrace, any of the things that we talked about on the show. You can find videos about them there. I think Instagram is also a good place to follow me. I post a lot of my little, little snippets from publicity on there with, you know, little, little things that I think are helpful. And that’s my name, but you have to smush it together.
Susan Bratton [00:55:42]:
A lot of people try to steal my name and set up fake accounts and stuff. So it’s all one word. Susan Bratton. S U S A N B R A T T O N Susan Bratton. You can follow me on there and you can always slide into my DMs, but if you’re going to ask me a question, it’s better to reply to my better lover emails because then I’m in front of my computer and not on my phone and I can do a better job of answering any questions that you have. And if you’d like me to come back and talk about sexual regenerative therapies, sexual hacking, etc, extending your sex span, I’d be delighted to. I’d come back anytime and talk about that because the last thing we want is for things to be preventing you from having the fourth factor. Intimacy.
Susan Bratton [00:56:26]:
Extending your sex span that are so easy to fix if you just knew what to do.
Lora Cheadle [00:56:30]:
Yeah, let’s absolutely do that because that is something that I hear a lot too. Oh my gosh, I can’t start over. I’m 40 and I’m like, oh my God, yes you can.
Susan Bratton [00:56:40]:
You’re just a baby. You’re just a baby. Oh, you’re just a little baby. You’re just getting started. Don’t worry, it’s all in front of you.
Lora Cheadle [00:56:49]:
So let’s extend that so at any age you can have the best sex and the best intimacy of your life. So thank you so much. I look forward to our next conversation.
Susan Bratton [00:57:01]:
Me too.
Lora Cheadle [00:57:02]:
Good. And listeners, have an incredible week. And as usual, always remember to flaunt exactly who you are because who you are is always more than enough.
